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    <title>Lucas is Das Bloggin' - BMW</title>
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    <copyright>Lucas J. Krammes 2008</copyright>
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      <dc:creator>Lucas J. Krammes</dc:creator>
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        <p>
I have had a number of people personally ask me to put my opinions about this on paper,
specifically “How to buy a CPO BMW”.  If you don't already know, I have what
some would call a mild obsession with BMW, and by mild I mean <em>SUPREME BRAND LOYALTY</em>.
</p>
        <p>
That doesn't mean that I am willing to break the bank for one.  Before my wife’s
328xi, I haven't owned a BMW less than 10 years old.  Before you make judgment,
I have almost 400,000 miles on my 2 BMW’s, I have loved every second being behind
the wheel of them, and I paid less combined than you did for that Camry, but I digress…
I am not going to go into the <em>countless</em> reasons why I think BMW’s are the
best car to own, but I am going to go into some tips on how to buy them.  Before
you quit reading this because you don't think you can afford a BMW, think again.  
</p>
        <p>
BMW’s Certified Pre Owned program is a certification placed on a car by the dealership. 
Before the car can even be considered as a CPO, it has to sight unseen pass a certain
number of criteria (miles, no body damage, year of production, etc.).  Even the
smallest aesthetic flaw can keep a BMW from being granted the CPO title.  Generally
these cars come from 30,000 mile leases.  Then the dealer “refreshes” the car
to make it pass a much more extensive quality checklist.  This could mean brand
new tires, new brakes, etc. etc.  Then, they sell it as a <em>CPO</em> and offer
it with what is essentially the closest you are ever going to come to a new car warranty <em>on
a used car</em>.  The warranty gets extended 6 years from the production day,
therefore, 2007 CPO’s are warranted until 2013.  In addition, they are often
sold with new-car interest rates (we got 1.9%, but it all depends on the current specials
BMW financial is running at the time).  If your credit is good, ask them to take
a point off the rate, some dealerships will eat the point to sell the car.
</p>
        <p>
So, there are a few things that you need to know <em>before</em> you start looking:
</p>
        <p>
1)  What do you want?  What are the bare minimum features that you are willing
to have?  My wife whom we were shopping for luckily already had this down pat: 
“I want 4 wheel drive, heated seats, sunroof, a a CD player.”  Those were the
deal breakers.  If you don't know that going in, then employing this strategy
will be tough, because you can get lost in a sea of features in these cars.
</p>
        <p>
2)  What is the absolute maximum you are willing to spend?  We are not going
to start negotiating there, we are actually going to probably start about 3000-5000
dollars less.  But, you need to know this number so you know when to leave. 
This is, after all, a business deal.  A good gambler knows when to walk away,
you should too.
</p>
        <p>
A friend of mine once taught me how to buy a new BMW, and I mean one that you are
having made and delivered from Germany (because then, you truly know what you want,
and what you are going to get).  Spec your car out completely, pick a price that
you find fair, go to every dealership in the area and offer them that price. 
If you make it to all of the dealerships in the area and they have all turned you
down, raise your price by X (my buddy used 50 bucks, that could take a while these
days) dollars and do it all over again, all the while making every dealership know
your motive.  At some point they are going to take what they can get because
a little profit is better than no profit.
</p>
        <p>
You can use parts of that strategy when buying a CPO BMW as well.  If you know
what you want, find the dealerships that have cars that fit your criteria.  Look
for ones within 6000-7000 of your price range and that have your minimum criteria
and<em> set up appointments at the dealership</em> (setting an appointment up will
keep you from standing around looking dumb waiting for someone to come out and talk
to you, and it lets the salesman know that you are serious). 
</p>
        <p>
          <strong>Rule #1 – Know your product.</strong>  It really helps to know what you
want to buy like the back of your hand, and it is also good to know the market in
the area, because you are going to go around to all the dealerships in the area to
see what they have to offer, right?  A good salesman will back off if you show
that you know what you are talking about.  They don't like to screw with you
if they know you can call them on it.  I had 2 salesmen say, “You know what,
I am going to shut up because it is obvious you know this car better than I do”. 
You don't have to be <em>obsessed</em> like me, but a little research can go a long
way.  Then you stop getting the potential salesman shtick, another characteristic
to tell them that you mean business.
</p>
        <p>
          <strong>Rule #2 – Take your time.</strong>  One of the main facets of this strategy
is that you have to have time.<strong>  </strong>If you need a car right NOW,
this isn't the way to do it.  If you don't care about the extra 5 grand, this
probably isn't for you.  If you are in a rush to buy, you aren't going to get
the best deal.  Our whole process took about 2 weeks, but we were shopping a
few months before to get some salesman's cards and see what was on the lot. 
We didn't even drive anything, just a little recon.
</p>
        <p>
          <strong>Rule #3 – Shop at the end of the month.</strong>  CPO BMW’s have a 60-90
day turnover where if they have been on the lot that long, BMW mandates that they
go to auction.  So, if you shop at the end of the month, there is a good chance
that there will be some cars on the lot that the dealership is <em>HIGHLY</em> motivated
to get rid of.  ALWAYS ask them how long the car has been on the lot.  If
it is anything over 2 months, you’ve gotta good chance of knocking some serious dough
off that sticker.  If it just got there, maybe it will be there in 2 months. 
For that matter, look often.  New CPO’s are hitting the lot almost daily in some
cases.
</p>
        <p>
          <strong>Rule #4 – Be willing to walk away.  </strong>After you have scheduled
your appointments, go drive the cars, find out if you would be happy behind the wheel
for the next 5 years, make sure this is a salesman you feel comfortable with (if you
do buy the car from him, it is nice to always have someone to call about the car in
the future).  Every dealership is going to try and crunch some numbers with you
that night.  Don’t do it, at least not tonight.  There are 5 BMW dealerships
in the NE Ohio area, so in our case, we had a lot more shopping to do.  There
is a good chance that even when you get in the negotiation room that you will want
to walk away.  It gives the dealership time to think about what they are willing
to get rid of the car for.  Consider it recon for yourself on where the market
is, and most importantly get a feel for how badly they want to sell the car. 
Also, because of rule #2, it is very possible that you may lose the opportunity on
some cars, but there will be more, I promise.  This CPO market is VERY driven
by inventory.  Some dealers will have killer prices on X3’s, and the other has
expensive X3’s but super deals on 328xi’s.
</p>
        <p>
          <strong>Rule #5 – Use what you have learned from shopping and researching.  </strong>Once
you get to a point where you are ready to buy, remember why you have been doing all
this research!  It would be a waste to have spent all that time and been too
shy not to voice it.  If a dealer has offered you what you think is a decent
price and you have walked away (which you should have at least once), let the other
dealers know what there competition is.  Don’t be an asshole, you don't have
to name names or be threatening, but you can say “Hey Salesman X, your competition
is a X dollar offer right now, if you cant beat that, I won’t waste either our times”. 
I had one dealer tell me he could not touch that price, and I had the other say “Yeah,
I can beat it by 1000 bucks”.  By the way, that was the car we bought.
</p>
        <p>
          <strong>Rule #6 – Learn a poker face.</strong>  Unless it is free, no matter
what number that dealer throws at you, be as unimpressed as the first time you tasted
a Bud Light.  Since you did your research, you already know what you want to
pay for the car.  It is very appropriate to say something like “I need that to
be around X dollars or we flat out cant make a deal here.”  You would be surprised
how much you can get knocked off of a car without even saying a word.
</p>
        <p>
Negotiation will almost undoubtedly be a little uncomfortable, but it is a good thing
to learn across many aspects of life, from negotiating a raise at your job, to buying
a car, to negotiating a price on a house, to buying something at a gun/trade show. 
You are out to do what is best for you, and the dealership is out there to make a
little money.  There is a balance there, but it is one you generally have to
fight for.
</p>
        <p>
Lastly, when you do buy a car, let the other salesmen know that you found something. 
You should have all of their contact info by now, and I think it is just common courtesy
so they don't have to keep looking for a car that meets your needs.  Plus, I
have never met someone that I have talked into a BMW that didn't buy one again, and
next time the “other guy” may have a better deal, and knowing someone the next time
you go shopping is one less step in the process.
</p>
        <p>
Using all of these strategies, I was able to get what I thought was a decent number
off the sticker, a warranty till 2013, valet service, loaner cars when it is being
serviced, and all the other luxuries you get from buying a new BMW (that not too many
others offer, btw).  With CPO prices on some cars less than 20K, it is <strong>absolutely
possible</strong> that you CAN afford the Ultimate Driving Machine.  Besides,
go look for any warranted new car for around 20 grand with all of those amenities,
you aren't going to find very much, and you won’t find anything the caliber of a BMW.
</p>
        <div style="padding-bottom: 0px; margin: 0px; padding-left: 0px; padding-right: 0px; display: inline; float: none; padding-top: 0px" id="scid:0767317B-992E-4b12-91E0-4F059A8CECA8:756b34a4-84f8-4a7a-b152-6385a7f01826" class="wlWriterEditableSmartContent">Technorati
Tags: <a href="http://technorati.com/tags/BMW" rel="tag">BMW</a></div>
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      </body>
      <title>Picture yourself behind the wheel of the Ultimate Driving Machine</title>
      <guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.krammesnet.com/PermaLink,guid,71fbe4ca-7739-4397-9550-6f34f4275296.aspx</guid>
      <link>http://blog.krammesnet.com/2010/01/29/PictureYourselfBehindTheWheelOfTheUltimateDrivingMachine.aspx</link>
      <pubDate>Fri, 29 Jan 2010 03:32:02 GMT</pubDate>
      <description>&lt;p&gt;
I have had a number of people personally ask me to put my opinions about this on paper,
specifically “How to buy a CPO BMW”.&amp;#160; If you don't already know, I have what
some would call a mild obsession with BMW, and by mild I mean &lt;em&gt;SUPREME BRAND LOYALTY&lt;/em&gt;.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
That doesn't mean that I am willing to break the bank for one.&amp;#160; Before my wife’s
328xi, I haven't owned a BMW less than 10 years old.&amp;#160; Before you make judgment,
I have almost 400,000 miles on my 2 BMW’s, I have loved every second being behind
the wheel of them, and I paid less combined than you did for that Camry, but I digress…
I am not going to go into the &lt;em&gt;countless&lt;/em&gt; reasons why I think BMW’s are the
best car to own, but I am going to go into some tips on how to buy them.&amp;#160; Before
you quit reading this because you don't think you can afford a BMW, think again.&amp;#160; 
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
BMW’s Certified Pre Owned program is a certification placed on a car by the dealership.&amp;#160;
Before the car can even be considered as a CPO, it has to sight unseen pass a certain
number of criteria (miles, no body damage, year of production, etc.).&amp;#160; Even the
smallest aesthetic flaw can keep a BMW from being granted the CPO title.&amp;#160; Generally
these cars come from 30,000 mile leases.&amp;#160; Then the dealer “refreshes” the car
to make it pass a much more extensive quality checklist.&amp;#160; This could mean brand
new tires, new brakes, etc. etc.&amp;#160; Then, they sell it as a &lt;em&gt;CPO&lt;/em&gt; and offer
it with what is essentially the closest you are ever going to come to a new car warranty &lt;em&gt;on
a used car&lt;/em&gt;.&amp;#160; The warranty gets extended 6 years from the production day,
therefore, 2007 CPO’s are warranted until 2013.&amp;#160; In addition, they are often
sold with new-car interest rates (we got 1.9%, but it all depends on the current specials
BMW financial is running at the time).&amp;#160; If your credit is good, ask them to take
a point off the rate, some dealerships will eat the point to sell the car.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
So, there are a few things that you need to know &lt;em&gt;before&lt;/em&gt; you start looking:
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
1)&amp;#160; What do you want?&amp;#160; What are the bare minimum features that you are willing
to have?&amp;#160; My wife whom we were shopping for luckily already had this down pat:&amp;#160;
“I want 4 wheel drive, heated seats, sunroof, a a CD player.”&amp;#160; Those were the
deal breakers.&amp;#160; If you don't know that going in, then employing this strategy
will be tough, because you can get lost in a sea of features in these cars.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
2)&amp;#160; What is the absolute maximum you are willing to spend?&amp;#160; We are not going
to start negotiating there, we are actually going to probably start about 3000-5000
dollars less.&amp;#160; But, you need to know this number so you know when to leave.&amp;#160;
This is, after all, a business deal.&amp;#160; A good gambler knows when to walk away,
you should too.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
A friend of mine once taught me how to buy a new BMW, and I mean one that you are
having made and delivered from Germany (because then, you truly know what you want,
and what you are going to get).&amp;#160; Spec your car out completely, pick a price that
you find fair, go to every dealership in the area and offer them that price.&amp;#160;
If you make it to all of the dealerships in the area and they have all turned you
down, raise your price by X (my buddy used 50 bucks, that could take a while these
days) dollars and do it all over again, all the while making every dealership know
your motive.&amp;#160; At some point they are going to take what they can get because
a little profit is better than no profit.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
You can use parts of that strategy when buying a CPO BMW as well.&amp;#160; If you know
what you want, find the dealerships that have cars that fit your criteria.&amp;#160; Look
for ones within 6000-7000 of your price range and that have your minimum criteria
and&lt;em&gt; set up appointments at the dealership&lt;/em&gt; (setting an appointment up will
keep you from standing around looking dumb waiting for someone to come out and talk
to you, and it lets the salesman know that you are serious). 
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
&lt;strong&gt;Rule #1 – Know your product.&lt;/strong&gt;&amp;#160; It really helps to know what you
want to buy like the back of your hand, and it is also good to know the market in
the area, because you are going to go around to all the dealerships in the area to
see what they have to offer, right?&amp;#160; A good salesman will back off if you show
that you know what you are talking about.&amp;#160; They don't like to screw with you
if they know you can call them on it.&amp;#160; I had 2 salesmen say, “You know what,
I am going to shut up because it is obvious you know this car better than I do”.&amp;#160;
You don't have to be &lt;em&gt;obsessed&lt;/em&gt; like me, but a little research can go a long
way.&amp;#160; Then you stop getting the potential salesman shtick, another characteristic
to tell them that you mean business.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
&lt;strong&gt;Rule #2 – Take your time.&lt;/strong&gt;&amp;#160; One of the main facets of this strategy
is that you have to have time.&lt;strong&gt;&amp;#160; &lt;/strong&gt;If you need a car right NOW,
this isn't the way to do it.&amp;#160; If you don't care about the extra 5 grand, this
probably isn't for you.&amp;#160; If you are in a rush to buy, you aren't going to get
the best deal.&amp;#160; Our whole process took about 2 weeks, but we were shopping a
few months before to get some salesman's cards and see what was on the lot.&amp;#160;
We didn't even drive anything, just a little recon.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
&lt;strong&gt;Rule #3 – Shop at the end of the month.&lt;/strong&gt;&amp;#160; CPO BMW’s have a 60-90
day turnover where if they have been on the lot that long, BMW mandates that they
go to auction.&amp;#160; So, if you shop at the end of the month, there is a good chance
that there will be some cars on the lot that the dealership is &lt;em&gt;HIGHLY&lt;/em&gt; motivated
to get rid of.&amp;#160; ALWAYS ask them how long the car has been on the lot.&amp;#160; If
it is anything over 2 months, you’ve gotta good chance of knocking some serious dough
off that sticker.&amp;#160; If it just got there, maybe it will be there in 2 months.&amp;#160;
For that matter, look often.&amp;#160; New CPO’s are hitting the lot almost daily in some
cases.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
&lt;strong&gt;Rule #4 – Be willing to walk away.&amp;#160; &lt;/strong&gt;After you have scheduled
your appointments, go drive the cars, find out if you would be happy behind the wheel
for the next 5 years, make sure this is a salesman you feel comfortable with (if you
do buy the car from him, it is nice to always have someone to call about the car in
the future).&amp;#160; Every dealership is going to try and crunch some numbers with you
that night.&amp;#160; Don’t do it, at least not tonight.&amp;#160; There are 5 BMW dealerships
in the NE Ohio area, so in our case, we had a lot more shopping to do.&amp;#160; There
is a good chance that even when you get in the negotiation room that you will want
to walk away.&amp;#160; It gives the dealership time to think about what they are willing
to get rid of the car for.&amp;#160; Consider it recon for yourself on where the market
is, and most importantly get a feel for how badly they want to sell the car.&amp;#160;
Also, because of rule #2, it is very possible that you may lose the opportunity on
some cars, but there will be more, I promise.&amp;#160; This CPO market is VERY driven
by inventory.&amp;#160; Some dealers will have killer prices on X3’s, and the other has
expensive X3’s but super deals on 328xi’s.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
&lt;strong&gt;Rule #5 – Use what you have learned from shopping and researching.&amp;#160; &lt;/strong&gt;Once
you get to a point where you are ready to buy, remember why you have been doing all
this research!&amp;#160; It would be a waste to have spent all that time and been too
shy not to voice it.&amp;#160; If a dealer has offered you what you think is a decent
price and you have walked away (which you should have at least once), let the other
dealers know what there competition is.&amp;#160; Don’t be an asshole, you don't have
to name names or be threatening, but you can say “Hey Salesman X, your competition
is a X dollar offer right now, if you cant beat that, I won’t waste either our times”.&amp;#160;
I had one dealer tell me he could not touch that price, and I had the other say “Yeah,
I can beat it by 1000 bucks”.&amp;#160; By the way, that was the car we bought.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
&lt;strong&gt;Rule #6 – Learn a poker face.&lt;/strong&gt;&amp;#160; Unless it is free, no matter
what number that dealer throws at you, be as unimpressed as the first time you tasted
a Bud Light.&amp;#160; Since you did your research, you already know what you want to
pay for the car.&amp;#160; It is very appropriate to say something like “I need that to
be around X dollars or we flat out cant make a deal here.”&amp;#160; You would be surprised
how much you can get knocked off of a car without even saying a word.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Negotiation will almost undoubtedly be a little uncomfortable, but it is a good thing
to learn across many aspects of life, from negotiating a raise at your job, to buying
a car, to negotiating a price on a house, to buying something at a gun/trade show.&amp;#160;
You are out to do what is best for you, and the dealership is out there to make a
little money.&amp;#160; There is a balance there, but it is one you generally have to
fight for.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Lastly, when you do buy a car, let the other salesmen know that you found something.&amp;#160;
You should have all of their contact info by now, and I think it is just common courtesy
so they don't have to keep looking for a car that meets your needs.&amp;#160; Plus, I
have never met someone that I have talked into a BMW that didn't buy one again, and
next time the “other guy” may have a better deal, and knowing someone the next time
you go shopping is one less step in the process.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
Using all of these strategies, I was able to get what I thought was a decent number
off the sticker, a warranty till 2013, valet service, loaner cars when it is being
serviced, and all the other luxuries you get from buying a new BMW (that not too many
others offer, btw).&amp;#160; With CPO prices on some cars less than 20K, it is &lt;strong&gt;absolutely
possible&lt;/strong&gt; that you CAN afford the Ultimate Driving Machine.&amp;#160; Besides,
go look for any warranted new car for around 20 grand with all of those amenities,
you aren't going to find very much, and you won’t find anything the caliber of a BMW.
&lt;/p&gt;
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Tags: &lt;a href="http://technorati.com/tags/BMW" rel="tag"&gt;BMW&lt;/a&gt;
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      <category>BMW</category>
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      <dc:creator>Lucas J. Krammes</dc:creator>
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        <p>
Really, I cant even answer this one yet.  It is really going to depend on what
I feel like writing about.  I don't plan on narrowing it down to one particular
topic, at least not yet.  However, I can tell you my interests and what I like
to talk about, and that will be that majority of the content:
</p>
        <p>
1.  I'm a .NET geek.  I want to use this blog to be an archive of the things
I have learned, and a place for new opinions to be shared.
</p>
        <p>
2.  I am a homebrewer.  I like to stretch the idea of what we call "traditional"
styles of beer.  I typically don't make anything that I could easily buy.  
</p>
        <p>
3.  I am a foodie and wine lover, so if I find something good, I may write about
it.
</p>
        <p>
4.  I am a BMW "enthusiast", which is probably an understatement.
</p>
        <p>
I guess what I am trying to say is, DISCLAIMER:  this blog is not purely technical,
but I hope that we will find something in common.
</p>
        <img width="0" height="0" src="http://blog.krammesnet.com/aggbug.ashx?id=d02122b6-42c7-4daa-a75f-3cca1a2838ce" />
      </body>
      <title>What is this blog going to be???</title>
      <guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.krammesnet.com/PermaLink,guid,d02122b6-42c7-4daa-a75f-3cca1a2838ce.aspx</guid>
      <link>http://blog.krammesnet.com/2009/01/10/WhatIsThisBlogGoingToBe.aspx</link>
      <pubDate>Sat, 10 Jan 2009 20:40:25 GMT</pubDate>
      <description>&lt;p&gt;
Really, I cant even answer this one yet.&amp;nbsp; It is really going to depend on what
I feel like writing about.&amp;nbsp; I don't plan on narrowing it down to one particular
topic, at least not yet.&amp;nbsp; However, I can tell you my interests and what I like
to talk about, and that will be that majority of the content:
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
1.&amp;nbsp; I'm a .NET geek.&amp;nbsp; I want to use this blog to be an archive of the things
I have learned, and a place for new opinions to be shared.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
2.&amp;nbsp; I am a homebrewer.&amp;nbsp; I like to stretch the idea of what we call "traditional"
styles of beer.&amp;nbsp; I typically don't make anything that I could easily buy.&amp;nbsp; 
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
3.&amp;nbsp; I am a foodie and wine lover, so if I find something good, I may write about
it.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
4.&amp;nbsp; I am a BMW "enthusiast", which is probably an understatement.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
I guess what I am trying to say is, DISCLAIMER:&amp;nbsp; this blog is not purely technical,
but I hope that we will find something in common.
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;img width="0" height="0" src="http://blog.krammesnet.com/aggbug.ashx?id=d02122b6-42c7-4daa-a75f-3cca1a2838ce" /&gt;</description>
      <comments>http://blog.krammesnet.com/CommentView,guid,d02122b6-42c7-4daa-a75f-3cca1a2838ce.aspx</comments>
      <category>.NET</category>
      <category>Beer</category>
      <category>BMW</category>
      <category>Food and Wine</category>
    </item>
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